1996 Mr.Pink

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NocturnalGTU
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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by NocturnalGTU »

If you dont feel a detonation at all but its still picking it up and registering one, then I would have to say its just an electrical issue. You could go buy some shielded loom that connects to body or engine ground and loom the engine bay harness, which isnt really that bad of an idea even without having this problem. 5v sensors work a lot better when they are shielded.


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by DTMAce »

Hey, wanted to update you Jon....

I happened to find another pile of the rear markers, I forgot about. I have like 3 RH and 5 LH total. Thinking about just boxing them all together, let you pick the ones you want, you could give me back the rest at Fest, or something. I owe you still for seat brackets anyway, forgot about that too. LOL


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by 3X00-Modified »

Whatever you want to do, I'm in no rush for them so if you want to save on shipping I'll just get them at bfest.

I have one on the red car that I think is uncracked, but I'm not sure how the backside looks where the bulb goes in. So I'll give that a shot first.

Nocturnal, Yeah I don't feel detonation at all but I can feel it pulling timing like crazy... If I disconnect the knock sensor then the car runs fine and doesn't skip a beat, if it leave it plugged in it will bog really bad when its pulling the timing.

If I get a chance tonight I'll swap out those wires for the Accel ones I have and see if that changes anything. I also have a box of plugs here that I can try out.

EDIT*
I hear about quite a few people running the TR55's in their 3400's and other engines and not having issues with them, so unless I have a problem with a plug itself I don't think that is my issue... Others are using the TR6 in place of the TR55 to get 1 more step colder, I may get a set of those this year for the nitrous.

I should have a set of Irridums at home that I can slap in there though just to try them out.


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by 3X00-Modified »

I just ohm'd my Accel wires and damn, they are spot on the 500 ohm a foot spec... so if I test those they should essentially "work" fine, its just a question of what the real issue is and if they are going to solve it.


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by 3X00-Modified »

Well I stand corrected, I thought I was running the TR55's but I had already realized I should be at least one more heat range cooler, so I had purchased and alread started running the TR6's as of last year. So the plugs looked fine, and I replaced the wires with the Accel ones but today on the highway going to work at 75mph the KR was still there and very strong too... 18* of retard pulling it down to 10* advance. as soon as I touch the gas and increase the load a slight bit the retard starts to drop at the recovery rate.

Next thing I brought with me is the ICM and a set of coils. I'll bring those in and ohm them today to be sure they are good and then swap one setup at a time... I think I'll try coils first.


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by Barry »

Wow that's a lot of retarding.

I hope its an ignition component and not something mechanical like bearings/pistonslap/trans issue. Even on crap gas there is no reason to knock at 10*


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by 3X00-Modified »

There are no noises and my red car had WAY more piston slap than this thing ever has had and it never registerd a bit... supposidly the ping makes a certain frequency and the sensor is setup to ignore stuff like piston slap or even a knock if a bearing is bad.


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by 3X00-Modified »

Info i found on ZZPerformance
Q:What is REAL KR and what is FALSE KR?
Real KR is KR that grows with engine RPM and engine load. It depends entirely on detonation, which is dependant upon throttle position, MAF, MAP, engine load, engine temperature, and RPM. As RPM and engine load increase, the chance for KR (or higher KR) increases. As the vehicle shifts to the next gear, KR will usually make a small jump up as well due to the higher engine load.

False knock is characterized by a sharp spike to an immediately high value of KR followed instantly by the KR Recovery Rate. It doesn't grow with engine RPM or load, it jumps to a high value on throttle input and then recovers to a low value, or zero perhaps, as engine RPM continues to increase. Note that this is exactly opposite to the characterization of REAL KR. Remember, knock is simply specific noise detected by engine microphones. Because it happens to fall with in the frequency of real KR does not necessarily mean that it IS real KR.

Q:What can cause FALSE KR?
Outlined below is a list of things that can cause false knock.
Sway bar hitting exhaust downpipe - This happens typically with the downpipe of headers because that configuration puts the downpipe in very close proximity to the sway bar … much closer than the stock downpipe. The banging noise from the two metal objects hitting may resonate through the frequency band that the PCM detects as knock through the knock sensors. The solution to this is to flip the swap bar over. Because of the curvature of the sway bar near the downpipe, flipping it will allow the sway bar to curve AWAY from the downpipe rather than toward it.

Transmission oil stick hitting exhaust crossover pipe - This typically happens with the crossover pipe of headers due to their large size and proximity as opposed to the stock crossover. The banging noise from the two metal objects hitting may resonate through the frequency band that the PCM detects as knock through the knock sensors. The solution to this is to carefully bend the trans oil stick away from the crossover pipe so that the two do not touch.

-Anything loose in the engine or outside the engine may cause noises that drift through the frequency range that the PCM detects as KR. Carefully check your engine! This is very vague and is intended to be vague because just about anything loose in or out of your engine that is making noise could cause this. This includes loose or noisy components in your transmission as well.

-Loose knock sensors, or knock sensors that are too tight. Double check that your knock sensors are torqued to spec (14 lb-ft).
I'm going after my coil bracket... I know its not connected to the upper intake and maybe thats vibrating just right...


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by 1988GTU »

Have you considered something in the timing cover might be making some racket to cause the false readout?


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by 3X00-Modified »

You referring to the timing chain? Its definitely a possibility but when it was so loose before it sounded like piston slap it never registered a peep... and it's not making a sound compared to the old cloyes setup I had run.

I put two rubber feet below the coil bracket and went for a quick ride... I did not get any KR on the highway when I was going only a few times at like 1800 RPM around town, which I can almost attest to bog knock since this engine is not happy that low. I can deal with that and accept it, its the 75mph on cruise control getting 18* of KR that is just unacceptable.


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by IsaacHayes »

So are you positive the ICM bracket vibration was the culprit?


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

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IsaacHayes wrote:So are you positive the ICM bracket vibration was the culprit?
YO. Make a update thread about yourself or ban :burn:


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by 3X00-Modified »

IsaacHayes wrote:So are you positive the ICM bracket vibration was the culprit?
No it didn't solve it. It was back on my way home. So I swapped out the coils with an old stock set. So far I got nothing on the highway on my way home... so I'm not calling it solved yet but there is a chance. I'll ohm the old coils tomorrow to see how they show up. Stock ones were 5.6k on the secondary side and 0.7 on the primary side, all the same.


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by 1988GTU »

3X00-Modified wrote:You referring to the timing chain? Its definitely a possibility but when it was so loose before it sounded like piston slap it never registered a peep... and it's not making a sound compared to the old cloyes setup I had run.

I put two rubber feet below the coil bracket and went for a quick ride... I did not get any KR on the highway when I was going only a few times at like 1800 RPM around town, which I can almost attest to bog knock since this engine is not happy that low. I can deal with that and accept it, its the 75mph on cruise control getting 18* of KR that is just unacceptable.
Chain/guide and maybe even interferences with the cover.


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Re: 1996 Mr.Pink

Post by 1988GTU »

You check your injectors for proper operation as of recent?

Older they get, they tend to spit and drip instead of shoot and spray.


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