Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

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beretta
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Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby beretta » Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:58 pm

Ive been trying to hold myself from appearing until i get on with my new project but cant resist lol.

Recently got myself another 96, shes black and rusty but has some good features..
came with...
duraflex vader kit brand new with wrap still on it
gtz wheels (not that i need 2 sets they are forsale)
spare doors from a gtz with the panels and power windows
rear interior gtz 1 piece panels
2 spare fenders
trunk lid
box of mixed stuff
..
The bad..
been sitting a few years.. this car was purchased from this owner out of Windsor i think he said... maybe its been on this board before...
Rockers are pretty much toast like where they join the floor boards they are missing lol. door pillars are bad in the bottom.
Sub frame is rusty but shes still solid
Floors are still solid
She runs and drives but i suspect intake gaskets are gone since the oil looks pretty yucky :bad:

....
I have restrained myself in the past to doing crazy things to my beretta's other then maybe a crazy spoiler on my 88 that does need to come off.. This body kit may take the beretta away from the car but i am putting it on this is my play toy and my other 96 will remain as stock as possible other then the engine.

My plans for the black 96..
My wish list as you could call it..

2010 G6 3500 motor/auto trans. i really wanted a 5 speed but i think im going to take the path of trying to stick the auto from the g6 in there since the price is right long as she didnt run away on me... I snagged the 3500 heads and intake off it couple weeks ago i think anyone else will open that hood and turn away after its been tore open.

Im not planning anything huge with the engine, i want a good size cam and matching valve springs, 65mm throttle body and spacer, maybe a underdrive pulley, possible other small cheap mods, and a good tune.
Im not really sure what kind of power to expect but I would be happy with 250 hp at the crank for now i think that will give it some get up and go and not just be all for show.

I debated on headers but im now taking another route, im going to use 2 front manifolds from a 3500 engine and runs duals off manifolds given that i have enough clearance on the front one to do that.

Installing the gtz door panels and rear gtz panels in it, leaving rest of interior as is.

Standard things i will be doing.
.Taring the car down to bare shell totally gut it.
.Sand blast any rusted areas and re paint
.replace rusted rockers and door pillars and everything between. ( i have new rockers) but i may have a rust free donar car to cut apart if things go right.
.replace all brake lines including flex lines
.replace all fuel lines
.replace all suspension parts regardless if it needs it, springs/struts/control arms/bushings/wheel bearings ect

Basically this car will be rebuild from ground up, at least thats the plan. i am in no rush, i know this wont happen over night. I recently moved and i now have all the space i need for storing my parts and have them organized as she comes apart and i now have a garage that has no other purpose besides working on beretta's in it.

I want to keep it black but will be repainted, i will be putting gtz rims on it and painting them black (will be leaving the lip polished) tint the windows out on it, leave the door decals off. And i will not be adding some crazy spoiler just because the body kit, keeping stock spoiler on it. And get marker lights and 3rd brake light converted to l.e.d..

Im going to restrain myself from adding any pictures of this beast until i get into the project. originally i was just not going to come on here until spring when it was done and surprise everyone with my new car, but ive been hiding long enough now and im probably going to be needed some help getting the 3500 in there running and possibly the auto trans from the g6 too i kinda need some input on that and how difficult it is and is it impossible.. I'll be snagging the ecm from the car as well as trany wiring, it has to be possible to make it work one way or another.

My 88 base is parked and put away for another year or 2.
My white 96z i have had a few issues id rather not discus all over the board about it makes me very sad to even think about it but i assure you i still have it and it will return in the spring with a new look.
And the new addition is the black 96 z. i couldnt pass up on this amazing deal, even with the rust for what i paid for the whole package you wouldnt believe me if i told you so ill just keep that to myself for now haha.

Anyhow, let me know some input on these ideas.



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Gtzman
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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby Gtzman » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:10 pm

The spare fenders, one a driverside?



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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby beretta » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:21 pm

Gtzman wrote:The spare fenders, one a driverside?


i have both sides. but im undecided if i need them just yet, by the end of this week i may have a 4th beretta so i kinda like hording parts for a while before i get rid of them lol.



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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby 3X00-Modified » Tue Oct 30, 2012 12:43 pm

Call me crazy but why cut up a rust free car to fix a rusted one.... Once you get it down to bare shell just swap all that 96 stuff to the rust free shell... no point in cutting it up to save a rusty one, seems like wasted effort since the shell's should be the same.

Also good luck with the 2010 G6 driveline... you need EVERY electronic part from that car to make it work... including all the security crap to even make it turn over, unless someone makes a tuner to bypass all of that. Otherwise you can't run a VVT 3500 with a 96 Beretta ECU, or even the 97 Venture/Monte ECU, without eliminating the variable valve timing option at least... and god who knows what else...



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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby beretta » Thu Nov 01, 2012 12:48 am

3X00-Modified wrote:Call me crazy but why cut up a rust free car to fix a rusted one.... Once you get it down to bare shell just swap all that 96 stuff to the rust free shell... no point in cutting it up to save a rusty one, seems like wasted effort since the shell's should be the same.

Also good luck with the 2010 G6 driveline... you need EVERY electronic part from that car to make it work... including all the security crap to even make it turn over, unless someone makes a tuner to bypass all of that. Otherwise you can't run a VVT 3500 with a 96 Beretta ECU, or even the 97 Venture/Monte ECU, without eliminating the variable valve timing option at least... and god who knows what else...



variable valve timing ????
How is this possible this engine has that ? do they all have it or just some of them ?
I took the heads and intake, everything looks the same as a 3100 or 3400 internally. if it was equipped with the variable valve timing would it not have some different type of lifters and valves so there was a way it could stop the ones on the 3 cylinders that shut down not to function ?
I thought that was only in the 3900 engine.

I guess its a bad thing that i hacked up a bunch of wires getting the heads off ? lol

If you could buy a 3500 and trany with 50,000 KM or less for $150. would you not take it ? If you planned at least a 6 month period to tinker with the car and get it running would you not try ? I am in no rush to finish it i dont care how long it takes but in the end its going to kick some @ss



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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby beretta » Thu Nov 01, 2012 1:07 am

The engine itself is pretty much the same as any other 60 degree v6 is it not ?

Why wont it work with obd2 ? theoretically all you need to do is put in all the sensors from the 3100/3400 and use that wire harness, why cant you make it work ? why cant the crank/cam sensor/ ect be used ? they make external crank triggers for other types of swaps.

The transmission i can see is a totally different ball game, to make it shift correctly would need the ecm from that car or be able to tune it out on obd2. if the ecm from the g6 needs to be used so you wire up what needs to be for it to shift and run the obd ecm to make her go vrrrrrhmmm vrrrhmm. lol



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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby scd88ga » Thu Nov 01, 2012 2:04 pm

One for me and one for 3X00-Modified...
Image


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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby 3400beretta » Thu Nov 01, 2012 2:34 pm

I saw the pictures of the engine he is talking about here and it is definately NOT VVT. So I'm guess that it is NOT a 2010 G6 as he thinks it is.



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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby scd88ga » Thu Nov 01, 2012 11:29 pm

If I recall, ALL of the 2007 and up G6's (V6 and 4 cyl) have VVT, 2.4, 3.5, 3.6 and 3.9...


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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby 3X00-Modified » Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:01 am

the non vvt 3500 was ONLY made from 05-07 You need to research your engines more before trying to do anything. You have a lot to learn.

3.5
LX9
The LX9 3500 is an OHV engine based on the 3400 V6. It incorporates electronic throttle control. Bore is 94 mm (3.7 in), stroke is 84 mm (3.3 in) for a displacement of 3498 cc (213 cu in). A GM Press Release for the 2004 Malibu described the 3500 thus: "3.5-liter V-6, will debut in the 2004 Chevrolet Malibu. The engine offers improved performance and fuel efficiency, and runs smoother and quieter than earlier generation V-6 engines. The 3500 V-6 features an advanced powertrain control module, improved fuel injection system, a redesigned exhaust manifold and a new catalytic converter contribute to reduced emissions, as well as improved efficiency and performance characteristics. Improvements in cooling, sealing and the accessory drive system add to the engine's overall quality, reliability and durability." Power output ranges from 196 hp (146 kW) to 201 hp (150 kW), torque ranges from 213 lb·ft (289 N·m) to 221 lb·ft (300 N·m).
It was used in the following vehicles and model years:
2005–2006 Buick Terraza/Chevrolet Uplander/Pontiac Montana/Saturn Relay
2004–2006 Chevrolet Malibu/Chevrolet Malibu Maxx
2005–2006 Pontiac G6 Sedan / Coupe
2006–2007 Buick Rendezvous
2006 Pontiac G6 GT Convertible


And info about the G6

When the G6 was introduced in 2005, it had two trim levels, base "V6" and sportier "GT". Both trims, however, used a 3.5 L pushrod V6 producing 200 horsepower (150 kW) and 220 lbf·ft (300 N·m) of torque. Matched to a four-speed automatic transmission, the GT featured TAPshift, where the driver could select the gears manually. Base models were well equipped, featuring power locks, windows and mirrors with keyless entry, six-speaker CD stereo, power drivers seat, air conditioning and split folding rear seat. GTs added an eight-speaker Monsoon stereo, premium cloth seats with six-way adjustment, remote start, ABS and traction control.

In 2006, the G6 added two new trim levels and two new bodystyles, a coupe and a retractable hard top convertible. The new trim levels were a new base four-cylinder trim (sometimes referred to as "SE"), and the high performance "GTP". Coupes and convertibles were available in GT and GTP trims only. The new base model used a 169-horsepower, 2.4 L DOHC inline-4, mated to a four-speed automatic transmission. The 3.5 L V6 was now part of a sport-package on the base/SE, and remained standard on the GT. The new GTP used a 3.9 L version of the GT's 3.5 L V6, but also utilizes variable valve timing (VVT), increasing output to 240 horsepower. A four-speed automatic transmission was standard, but for no cost, a six-speed manual transmission was available. The GTP convertible was not available with the manual transmission and reduced its power to 227 hp, due to a more restrictive exhaust system. The GTP also features stability control, not available on other G6 models.
The 2007 G6 saw more engine changes, and standard side torso and side curtain airbags (actually introduced late in the 2006 model year) were new. The GT now featured VVT on its 3.5 L V6, raising power from 200 hp to 224 hp. The 3.9 L V6 became an option on the GT, producing 227 horsepower in automatic transmission form and 240 horsepower in manual transmission form. The GTP was given a new 3.6 L DOHC V6 with 24 valves and VVT, producing 252 horsepower. It is mated to a six-speed automatic transmission. Midway through the model year the six-speed was dropped with the 3.9 L, along with its 240 horsepower output. The GTP convertible was also discontinued. For 2008, the GTP became the GXP with more dramatic styling cues, and the 3.9 L engine became an exclusive convertible option, with horsepower down to 222. SAE ratings also dropped the horsepower ratings on the 2.4 L and 3.5 L models to 164 hp and 219 hp (217 hp on convertibles), respectively.

For 2009, 2.4 L four-cylinder engines were added to the coupe lineup. During 2009, GM went through a major restructuring, the Pontiac brand was to be cancelled, and the 2010 Pontiacs would never see reality. So GM created the 2009.5 model year to use up all available parts that were made for the 2010 model. Changes consisted of a revised front and rear fascia as well as a revision on the interior . During the final weeks of production GM created yet another G6 trim level for the last of the coupe models, called the G6X, that consisted of what ever was left in the GM parts bin. These last G6X coupes received upgraded equipment, such as the larger Pontiac G8 wheels, tires, and brakes. Most of the one-hundred G6X coupes came with the 3.5 L however the last twenty-five came with the top of the line 3.9 L V6. The final 100 G6 sedans were built November 25, 2009 as part of a fleet order; these were the last United-States-built Pontiac automobiles.[3]
GM began marketing the Buick brand in Mexico to replace Pontiac after the 2009 model year, so GM was forced to replace the Pontiac G6 with the larger Buick LaCrosse, while in the United States & Canada, the G6 & the Saturn Aura were replaced by GM's revived Buick Regal nameplate.
The last Pontiac G6 rolled off the assembly line on November 25, 2009


Just swap everything over plug it in and give me a shout when it's going "vrrrrrhmmm vrrrhmm"



beretta
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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby beretta » Fri Nov 02, 2012 5:16 pm

So the lx9 is a possible swap... the one from a 2010 is not possible ?
How does it have vvt ? ive done some reading on vvt, and most engines have a 2nd cam or one that has both small and larger lobes and being able to move the cam to the higher profile lobes in acceleration.

The cam in this 3500 looks the same as any 3100/3400 ive had opened up..

I have done some research on running a 3500 on obd2.
Throttle body : 3400 with adapter
External 7x trigger
egr adapter
install 3x00 timing cover for 24x trigger
install lower mount on oil pan
install driver side dog bone mount
customize passenger side mount
use 3100 exhaust or customize
use 3100 alternator/bracket
install 3100 power steering pump
use 3100 harness and cut and wire injectors and coolant temp sensor
remove oil filter neck and screw to the block
install knock sensor and there is a spot for it.
and ac may not work..

So use a 3100/3400 timing cover, use the crank sensor and harmonic balancer and install knock sensor, wire injectors. plug and play everything else.

The block is essentially the same as a 3100/3400 ? if the cam shaft is different install a 3400 cam. i would be putting a performance one in anyways.

Why wont it run ? if you can inter-grade all the sensors and wiring from a 3100 to the 3500 why wont it run.



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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby 3400beretta » Fri Nov 02, 2012 5:43 pm

Going by the pictures you showed me it is a regular LX9 NON-VVT 3500, that means the car was a 2005-2007. Period.



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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby 3X00-Modified » Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:21 am

I guess your not reading what I said... I said the 3500 VVT engine will not run without major ECM changes I never said a 05-07 NON VVT engine wouldn't run... I'm done with this thread.



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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby 3400beretta » Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:30 am

Jon, my post is directed at him. He is confused on what engine he actually has. He thinks it is a VVT, but it is most definately not, and therefore it is not from a 2010 car as he thinks.



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Re: Boo I'm Back and Have another new beretta

Postby 3X00-Modified » Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:49 am

yeah I know and my post is also directed at him... his last question in his post sounds like I stated a 3500 from 05-07 wouldn't run, Sorry should have quoted who I was replying to.

Bottom line he didn't even know that the VVT exists, so to him the year the engine came from doesn't matter... He thinks he has a 2010 and had no clue that wouldn't work or would even be a VVT motor.

I think someone needs to clarify to him what he bought... aka the original seller of that engine/trans combo since they don't know what they are even selling.




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